Letters from Eddie

Mate....spend some time on this and send me ALL your questions. Then I will spend the time to answer them all the best I can. The ones you sent already are a piece of cake when you understand the essence of what Jesus conversation. As you sent some questions in your last email to me saying that ....these are just a tiny example of the questions you want to ask ... So instead of answering just a few of your questions, I am asking you to spend some time to find all your questions on this subject and then send them all to me so I can answer them all in one go, which makes it easier on me and alsomakes it easier for you to understand that way.

There is one thing you fail to do though mate, as I can easily tell by your questions (no offence mate, not just you, but many also make this mistake as I once did also), the first question you should always ask yourself when reading scripture is...WHO is the speaker speaking to? When you work this out, then you can finally understand the truth of the matter, and follow the rest in the correct context. Now I didn't want to be the one to tell you this, especially as I also used to read all the bible thinking it was for me, just like you do now, but after studying many years now on this subject I can now pass onto you ( if you want...just say no if you want and I totally understand) what I have learned. The questions you asked about the bible indicate to me that you believe every word God speaks through His prophets AND Jesus who is the greatest of all prophets, is meant for you. Mate, that's totally ok with me, but by doing so, I am telling you that it is impossible for you to know the truth of what Jesus is saying. Unless you put things in CORRECT context, as Jesus would expect, you are doomed to failure ... I can boldly announce that to you my friend. If I was not your friend and did not care for your soul, I would not be wasting my time, but I love you as family, and so I offer the truth that I have found to you for free. It cost me much to find these things, but I offer it to you freely. If you disagree, then tell me mate, it will not affect our friendship I promise. The fact that you said the other day I don’t share with you what I believe is the main reason I am telling you all this. It's up to you mate what you do with it. The whole crux of this paragraph above is "CONTEXT"... ignore it at your own peril friend.

End note: When reading scripture, especially prophecy, the first question you should ask is "who" is the prophet/speaker aiming his message at. Also you need to know where,when,why,and how all this will take place. Any messages from God should not be "skimmed" over... it should be analysed thoroughly.

One thing regarding the helium balloons. That happened about 2 years ago, and at the time I blurted it out all over paltalk... you were probably asleep hehehe. You must have seen an old replay. The guy was on a street corner with a bunch of helium blow ups of some Arab dressed figures for a play or concert that he was taking them to. They they accidentally got loose, and the man who was also dressed in Arab garb was reaching up for them, and it was this picture that the woman saw. She probably thought that Arab figure was Jesus, and the blow ups were Christians, and leapt to her death as you said, through the sun roof. This episode alone should be a warning to all of that false doctrine.

No explanation needed

Oh, one last thing to stop ur whining about stealing ur words haha. Mate, you read the bible...and I read the bible, and if God gives us both the same word on a subject, then this goes to show God is good to us both...right? Am I also stealing ur belief in a non-rapture lol. I listened to you on this subject, and agreed, so I believed. Oppps, did I change my mind? hehe. And the word rapturist...sheesh mate, do you realise what you said there? Gimme a break...the word is in the dictionary! No mate, I don't steal, I listen. I know you seem to be half joking about this stealing stuff...but it's getting to be a pain in the butt mate. Give it a rest. No explanation needed either except that it was getting a bit out of hand mate, that's all. Nobody likes to be accused of stealing others material if in fact they aren't, and even if they are guilty, they still don't like it. If I had of known the CONTEXT of your meaning, it might not have been so bad. I think there is a lesson for both of us there :-)

I am seriously considering writing a book on the rapture doctrine and the 2nd Advent. Because of the carnal and ignorant attitudes of most believers today (and I was one of them not too long ago), this book will have to go into great detail in order to satisfy their self cantered little carnal minds. I can say this now because God has revealed it to me...NOT because I am at all smart. Remember tiger, God gives wisdom to the dumb and confounds the wise. I fit perfectly into the dumb category, and so are really realy grateful for what wisdom God has given me :-) After receiving from God the revelation of His Son's message, I feel a great need to write about it in order for others to see the truth in it. If they do not see it, it is not because the can't, but rather because they don't want to. I was ignorant of this truth for the best part of 20 years, and only through obedience has God given me so much grace over the last 12 months or so. The words above like ..self cantered and carnal and ignorant, are meant for those who take God for granted, just like I did up until recently, and who are not hungry enough for the truth, so they can only substitute truth for what they can carnally and ignorantly find. They have no other way, as I once did also, to find the truth because of the lack of study and research, so they follow as blind sheep the doctrines of man. And even though they have it in black and white before their very eyes...they still cling to these false doctrines. Why? Simple, because these man made doctrines suit the flesh more. People WANT a rapture, and people WANT Jesus to rule them in the flesh ... but alas mate, this is a delusion that is deserving to the believer according to their hearts. That is why I say they are self cantered, just like I was. The reason I say the book would need to go into great detail is because they will take allot of convincing as you will also, to overcome this fleshy dream of magical raptures and eternal life in the flesh with Jesus as flesh king. Can you see it mate? It's all desires of the flesh, and nothing at all to do with the truth which is spiritual.

Now I will answer your few simplest questions now, but please mate, do as I ask and make a list of all you can find. It will help me as well as you in the long term. When you understand the truth in this matter you will also understand the importance of knowing it...it is a life saver.

In black is what you wrote and blue is my answer.

Eddie : 14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
I’ve noticed you’ve used the words Rome and Roman in all of the sections. How does that relate as the world, as the whole of the Earth? If reading as it appears to be listed in your text, is Jerusalem considered to be the whole world?

Mike : To answer your first question on the Romans. Could you please show me where I relate Rome as the whole world because that would be a mistake. The "world" as mentioned by Jesus in Mathew 24 is typically the general area of the Jewish religion which would certainly take in Rome as well, but not specifically Rome, and not specifically Jerusalem either. Basically it was the Roman empire incompassing Jerusalem.

Now for the second part regarding Jerusalem. The point needed to understand here is that the 'world' to the Jews was their territory/area. Jews worked in Rome as well as Jerusalem and many surrounding areas as you well know, so the world to the Jews, and as portrayed by Jesus, encompasses all these area's. Again, this is why we MUST distinguish WHO Jesus is talking to know the full meaning of His words. You have to realise that at this stage in Mathew 24, Jesus was to come only for the Jews, and so it is the Jewish world in question here...not the whole earth as you suppose.

If you read the acts of the disciples and of Paul you will notice that they had already preached the gospel in all (their) world. Remember when Jesus was telling the disciples they will be hated in all the nations mate? Was he telling them or us? This is the dilemma we get into when we ignore context. It's a matter of life and death really. I mean Paul said somewhere in Colossians that the gospel had already been preached in all the world, and this was before the destruction of Jerusalem. Remember mate, Jesus came for the Jews, to save them from their sin, and it was only after they denied Him that WE received the gift of salvation. At the time this whole message was given...the Jews were the world to the Jews, and Jesus was a Jew, speaking to Jews.

I am glad you brought this up because if you are struggling to understand my writing on my web page, there probably are many others who will also, so it is God telling me to expand this message. Its sorta like these instructions I got the other day to install a certain inviro system to save water by recycling water through the toilet cistern. I could not understand the instructions, so I asked another plumber and he couldn't either, so I rang the guy who sold it to me and he said that most plumbers are having the same problem understanding those instructions because the writer took it for granted that we plumbers are already familiar with these types, and so narrowed down his notes. I have done the same here I guess and son I need to expand. It will be my first assignment as soon as I get all this aeroplane stuff sorted out.

Eddie : Since the bible is written to the believers (pagans will not believe it), Jesus was speaking to those with an ear to hear. Right? That in the text of the time would be those by name or area. Since Christ/Father's words are immortal, it is valid for all time. In being valid for all time, it would be just as evident/potent today as any other time. Since God and His word is the same yesterday, today and forever and He is His word, no time lock out would be present.

Mike : Mate, what you have written above is the perfect example of using the bible out of context. Please bro, don't follow the multitude who are falsely taught that the bible speaks to them personally. Read it as a novel and you will understand it better. Not perfectly, but at least better than what is taught to the multitude. The first part of Revelation was talking to the seven churches...not to me mate.! But does that mean I don't listen to the message? Absolutely not...it shows what we should do and not do also. It is Gods words forever as you say mate, BUT, if you recon it speaks directly to the people of today, then you cant help but miss the essence of the story. And with Paul also, was he speaking to us personally? Absolutely not bro, but it is still a good story for us to learn by...by what God does to others back then, He will also do to us today if we mess up. So yes, His words are eternal in that sense...but no, the bible rarely speaks directly to us. As a matter of fact it hardly speaks to us at all in the scheme of things.

When Jesus spoke the words in question here, He spoke them DIRECTLY to the disciples, not you or me or anyone else ... He did not speak to 'those with an ear' in this instance. He spoke to those with an ear when He went public, but in this case He was private with the disciples ONLY, and answering THEIR questions, not yours or mine. You are right when you say the bible was written for believers, but in context, it is not all for us believers, although it is all good for learning as Paul said. Most of the bible was written for a certain people of a certain time. If you read all the prophecies in the bible, you can find fulfilment for them somewhere else in the bible or history. You are right also by saying Gods words are for all time ... just be careful what is for you and what isn't. For example, we well know that the OT prophecies of the coming Messiah was directed to the Jews...not us, and we also know that the Messiah was Jesus right? But what do the Jews of today believe it meant? They believe ( because they recon those OT words of God were meant for them) that the Messiah is yet to come, contrary to what the true Jews believed at the time of Jesus on earth. They ran to the hills like Jesus told them to in His prophecy of Mat 24.

Mate, it might appear to you that I am picking on everything you say here, but that is not the way it is. Its just because everything you say is based on the pretence that the words of mat 24 are directed at you and me, so in that sense, if this is not true, then every other word you speak on this subject would have to be false also. You see mate, I am only picking on the false premise that mat 24 speaks to a future people...not so much you. Ok tiger? Once you see and understand this one single simple truth all other things will open up to you in a different light...the correct light. This is one of the most important truths in the whole bible, because it exposes the truth that Jesus is here today right now, just like every single believer in this world is saying when they profess Jesus is in their life. How can we ask Jesus into our lives if He isn't here already? Do you mean He sends someone else to us? Is He a liar? I know for sure He is in me because of the miracles and ongoing blessings and revelations, and I am sure you do too bro. I believe Jesus doesn't lie...so when He told the disciples that He would come SOON, He meant soon, not mean 2000 years or more later. If Jesus wanted to come back thousands of years later, He would have said...listen my good blokes, I go now, but I will be back in a long long long time. All you guys will be long dead, and mankind will be flying to the moon and doing organ transplants by then.

Eddie : One section of Matthew 24 you are listing:

7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name’s sake.
10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Mike : All the above was fulfilled during the tribulation of the Jews between AD64 and AD70 when Jerusalem was finally levelled. Like you mate, I could not believe all the above had already happened, that was until I read the writings of Flavius Josephus who is the oldest witness to the destruction of Jerusalem. He was born about the time Jesus died and was a disciple of one of the other disciples...I cant remember which one at the minute, but he died at the turn of the first century, so apart from the writings in the bible, his are the next oldest and can be trusted as he was later attached to one of Jesus' followers. This guy talks about things happening like never before...earthquakes, pestilence and everything that is mentioned in the verses above. Remember, the disciples were killed because of Jesus' name sake also, just like He said they would. If you want I can get the historical account of it and send it to you. Sooner of later you will have to read it.

Eddie : From verse 7: Are not nations rising up against nation in this time of 2006 and have been for many past generations? Do we still not have pestilences, earthquakes, famines as well as floods, more powerful storms growing with greater intensity these days than in any other time of the past?

Mike : Mate, we have had nation rising against nation ever since Adam and Eve, but the point is, according to the history books, during AD65-70 there were also many wars and rumours of wars, more than now even. At the moment, it seems to be more peaceful ( except for them darn Muslims) than ever before in history. Iraq is not a war against a nation...it is war against terror. Different thing totally. Its more religion against religion now. Anyway, all through history this has been going on, but the historical accounts of AD70 were pretty bad. I don't see any mention of storms in the endtime prophecy (its possible I missed it tho), but as far as the pestilence and earthquakes etc, there was plenty of that during the destruction of Jerusalem. Those unbelieving Jews suffered so much with hunger that some even ate their own children.

Eddie : From verse 8: If these are the Beginnings when spoken to happen, why are they multiplied today if not still in tribulation? If we are still in tribulation then what did Jesus promise at His return, continued tribulation?

Mike : How do you know they are worse today than back then? Do you see 50,000 armed men running around USA or Australia killing all in their path? Do you see dead babies everywhere? Do you see hungry people eating their children? Quite the contrary mate, the worst thing that can happen to us is to end up on the dole...but we never will go hungry. You see mate, many others make this same mistake. If they knew history, then they would know that we live in the best times ever. We are not still in tribulation. Compared to the destruction of Jerusalem...this is heaven. Even the poorest people in the west don't go hungry.

Eddie : From verse 9 and 10: With today’s ever-rising political system with an agenda for condemning the ones in Christ (A.K.A United Nations and politics world wide), it rising to this point of ones being killed for their faith. Only the muslins get away with it scot-free. Another example if a homosexual is said to be wicked by God’s view then the person saying it is considered trouble. If Christ has returned, why is all this still going on?

Mike : Do you really believe that in this day and age that Christians could ever be killed by governments for doing nothing wrong? Christianity rules the world mate. Think about it. I can assure you for what it's worth mate, Countries like America, Australia, England, and half of Europe, that are Christian base, will never be killing Christians unless of course they go bonkers and kill others. There is only one way that can happen, and that is if Muslims rule the world. Even with nuclear weapons, Muslims will never get to do that mate. Many mainly Muslim populated countries like Pakistan, Turkey, and some African nations are on the side of the west because they know which side their bread is buttered. There is only one country that might be of any danger, and that is Iran, but even in Iran, the populous is protesting against the harsh treatment they get from their Government which is virtually run by that Muslim wacker Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, the religious leader of Iran. Christians have never ever in history been so protected, as what they are today. In the first century they were literally hunted like wild dogs by the Jews and Romans...today they run the world.

When Jesus was to come back, this wasn't to mean evil will stop, it simply meant there would be a place for all Christians who believed in the way of Christ, and a place for all those that didn't. Where Jesus talks of the new Jerusalem where there will be no darkness, this is simply the place we are in right now. Where there is Jesus Christ (like in you and me who are married to Him) there is no darkness (in us). But all the evil doers who don't believe are outside the new Jerusalem gnashing their teeth in darkness (i.e. evil) It's all symbolic mate. Apocalyptic language. Remember Jesus once said..."Oh Jerusalem, how I would like to gather you as a hen gathers her chicks". We are the new Israel in the new Jerusalem. Its outside where the evil is. Do you know what light is symbolic of? Righteousness...that's why the bible says the light will shine always. Why? Because Jesus is in us making us righteous. Mate, evil will always be around until the end of time. I don't know of even one place in the bible where it says evil will stop altogether. We must be careful not to take the whole bible literal as most teachers do today.

Eddie : From verse 11: Are there still false prophets running amuck today? If Jesus the Christ has returned back in 70AD, is He really allowing his name and His people to be slave to the wicked agenda of Satan?

AMike : gain mate, so long as there is evil, there will be deceivers, but what Jesus is speaking of here is the likes of Simon Magus and his camp who completely twisted the ways of Christ into another gospel that was not of God. There were others of course, but Magus and his dogs would have to be the main ones. Sure there are allot of false teachers today in the protestant circle, but when they start teaching things like idol worship and Mother of God worship, THEN we should be worried. So long as they stick to the basic principle of overcoming sin and the world...then they cant really do much damage.

Eddie : From verse 12: If Christ has returned, why are we still seeing the love growing cold?

Mike : See same answer as verse 9-10

Eddie : From verse 13: Enduring to the end - what is the end? End of what? Is the end when Christ returns?

Mike : Jesus is telling His disciples that if they endure to the end all the oppression and torture etc from the Jews and Romans, and remain faithful, they will be saved. So the end is when Jerusalem is destroyed and Jesus comes back, so yes, you got it right mate, the end is when Jesus returned. The end is the end of the old covenant and could only be complete when Jesus returned. That's the correct meaning, but this does not mean we can't use this verse (and others where they suit) as good teaching for all Christians obviously.

The word 'end' used throughout mat 24:3 when the disciples asked Jesus when will the end come, is actually a bad translation...do you research and find out that the correct word shout be "outcome"...not end. This now changes the whole meaning from an 'end of world' catastrophe to just the result of something. The same Greek word is also used in 1Cor 10:3 to mean 'escape' ... go figure! Nowhere does it suggest the end of this currant world. See how we can be mislead mate? ..and by so called teachers.

Eddie : In short, if Christ has returned and as per just one example verses like in: Matthew Chapter 13, where the wheat and the chaff are separated, where Christ takes out the evil at his return, I still try to see why we are seeing the evil triumph if Christ has already returned to fix all this.

Mike : I don't see this relevant to the return of Jesus, but it is a very good question. I know the answer mate, but I can't tell you right now. When I finally understood this parable, I soul leapt for joy mate. This parable is misunderstood by most according to what God gave me, but it is something that each lover of God must find for themselves I believe. Sorry, but I don't see in the bible where it says Jesus or God will fix all this evil when Jesus returns. See "New Jerusalem" where it says evil still exists after Jesus returns.

Consideration.

The evidence FOR the first century return of Christ is much greater than that for a future coming. The great early Christian writers such as Eusebius and Crysostom, together with many bible commentators agree. To go against what Jesus said to His disciples in the Olivet Discourse prophecy and expect a future 2nd Advent is to call Jesus a liar. When Jesus said He would return SOON, and St John said they ( Christians) were in the last hours, that's EXACTLY what they meant in this case. When you consider that at the time Jesus said this, creation was only 4000 years old, and to expect 2000+ years to mean "soon" in the scheme of things, is utterly ridiculous. And to say that Jesus is in us when we don't believe He is even here, is a bit hypocritical to say the least. A few hundred years of brain washing has manufactured a modern day teaching method that goes totally against the grain of the way of Jesus who is the Master teacher, and to go with this false teaching like a blind sheep is only ............ to the lukewarmness of modern Christianity.

Ok, all done. I put allot into this mate, so I hope this helps give more understanding. I would like (with your permission ) to add it to my web site... it would help others with same questions. I don't profess to be 100% correct on all things as I would be surprised if anyone could guarantee that, but the theme, i.e the 2nd Advent, I am sure of. Not only am I sure, but this truth is more like in keeping with the character of the God I know. He has always been a just God, and raptures and dreams of Jesus ruling in the flesh, is contrary to His nature.

Later mate

Mikey

end Mike

Hello Mike. Thanks for spending a few hours on the letter and sending it out as you did. This is the response to your letter. Yes, it long but covers a few examples of what you have said. I would love to put more time into this document than I really have time for at the present. I’ve tried with great care to keep the typos to a minimum. Because of the time factor and the likelyhood I'm misunderstanding some of your text, it would be great if I could cover every detail of your text but that would take about a week of 4 hours a day to fully grasp every nuance of the subject you’ll likely address. I’ve tried to read your text with great care. I’m sure there are areas you were sharing which I’m not translating properly. In time, you’ll help me better understand things I’ve misunderstood.

My installments will be in green, any other color is hard to read. I know what we need. A message board type of tool for better collaboration. Well, that’s another iron in the fire for the future. For now this email will have to do. Time has been tight. So tight I’ve had 4 to 5 active events happening simultaneously. Yeah, it gives me a headache to think about it. Anyway, here is the text for the moment.

Now I didn't want to be the one to tell you this, especially as I also used to read all the bible thinking it was for me, just like you do now, but after studying many years now on this subject I can now pass onto you ( if you want...just say no if you want and I totally understand) what I have learned. The questions you asked about the bible indicate to me that you believe every word God speaks through His prophets AND Jesus who is the greatest of all prophets, is meant for you.

Replay One: As we talked about in chat…. You asked which was the greatest prophet. I told you it is Carnal to think like that: That any ‘true’ in the Most High God would pronounced what God has given them to say. Yes, there were Major and Minor prophets but even that is just as they are seen by people. God does not does not think in such a foolish ways. He seeks the heart and obedience. You agreed 100% saying… “Never mind, you’re right..”

Now, if you said Jesus was the greatest servant, greatest witness and greatest teacher, and the one perfect in faith without limitation, then yeah, you would be 100% right.

Mate, that's totally ok with me, but by doing so, I am telling you that it is impossible for you to know the truth of what Jesus is saying. Unless you put things in CORRECT context, as Jesus would expect, you are doomed to failure ... I can boldly announce that to you my friend. If I was not your friend and did not care for your soul, I would not be wasting my time, but I love you as family, and so I offer the truth that I have found to you for free. It cost me much to find these things, but I offer it to you freely. If you disagree, then tell me mate, it will not affect our friendship I promise. The fact that you said the other day I don’t share with you what I believe is the main reason I am telling you all this. It's up to you mate what you do with it. The whole crux of this paragraph above is "CONTEXT"... ignore it at your own peril friend.

I don’t get offended to anything you say. I try to be adult about behaving as above the flesh would like. Promise to do the same with my comments? Correct Context is exactly why I’m asking questions in the last mails and not telling you how foolish you are when you say something unbecoming to what I have learned. As I’ve told you, I’m in a moment by moment evaluation seeking new challenges with progressing forward to any new unknown concept. If you are seeing my questions as be factious, then you would not bother to answer them or try to answer them.

The only thing you did do one time which was shocking was when you invited me in the room with the pederast 70AD guy and boldly told me: “This is what I believe and if you don’t like it, you can find yourself another friend!” Mate, that was a bit ‘cold-blooded‘. Do you remember doing that? You did. I thought about it all night at work. I was very disturbing how just a few weeks with another, the 3^rd paltalk doctrine pusher you get involved with has got you to say something so rude. First it was Vic, then Matthew Lancaster and now this new one. Visiting rooms are ok but not to adopt anyone’s views. Again before you get offended, please read this all the way through with the same care as I done in reading your text.

Learning truth and learning doctrines are not the same. As to the statement you made on the microphone that night, I just overlooked it and let you have space as I have when you were with Vic and Matthew. Today is the same and it will be just as so in future. Does that show me as being one not trying to make you in my mold? You make up your own mind. Just like the dream you had: God telling: “You can believe what you want to believe but it may not be truth“. That may be a dream for you, or could have been a sub-conscious reaction but no matter, is a message for all of us. You, me and all that claim or want to be full in God of the most high.

Ok, you keep telling me whom Jesus was talking to as the speaker to the listeners. Maybe by the end of this mail you have sent, you’ve added who these listeners are.

In the last line, you are talking about analyzing properly. By the time you see the end of this text, you’ll see I’ll be addressing the method of analylist. This will be seen as Spiritually and Carnally.

Just a sub note from one of your last emails: You said you’re planning to write a book on the Rapture. Not much a point these days to many. A grand number of God's children are not into it anymore. Only the ones trying to sell books or the readers scared of facing reality and not knowing God’s protection in the time of trouble will read such dribble as what the rapture authors write. Many people are waking up beyond the ‘get out of here’ but many are learning their identity in God and knows He will not only protect them but make the ones full in faith, pillars for witnessing by words and more important, by ‘living’ the stability of what God promised.

If you do write one, please refrain from all the normal mess of writing history, history, history of who created it and how the Roman Catholic church pushed it. - That’s a waste of time. It feeds the reader with doubts for the weaker tying to find which end is up. If it is to be written, it MUST be pure evidence of bible verses and how they show is false. You see, its not the debate text which brings truth and freedom to any but overstepping all that and presenting the truth by verses. Just like I’ve done with Ruining the Rapture and Rupturing the Rapture letters. Did you notice, how there was not 20 miles of text on the history the readers didn’t need? It was what the bible said. You see, that is the problem with books written in past years and even today. What man has said… what man has done, what man has said… what man has done. All dribble. Any fool can write a book. Its only the ones called by God into true ministry for God that prevail as evident with signs and wonders. So, from that. If you want to write a publication or even a book which is effective, pay attention to what the bible says and so can your readers know more about God and His supreme character. If you do have to write history on history, do it on the website so a link can be added to give choice to the reader if he or she wishes to research the historic angle of the subject.
This is not just rambling but proven as the 2 letters I’ve sent out reached international attention and has been read by more than I truly know. Hey, that is when all the enemies showed who they were. Remember the ‘death treats’ I told you of? They came just after those were released back in 2001.

I will answer your few simplest questions now, but please mate, do as I ask and make a list of all you can find. It will help me as well as you in the long term. When you understand the truth in this matter you will also understand the importance of knowing it...it is a life saver.

14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

I’ve noticed you’ve used the words Rome and Roman in all of the sections. How does that relate as the world, as the whole of the Earth? If reading as it appears to be listed in your text, is Jerusalem considered to be the whole world?

To answer your first question on the Romans. Could you please show me where I relate Rome as the whole world because that would be a mistake. The "world" as mentioned by Jesus in Mathew 24 is typically the general area of the Jewish religion which would certainly take in Rome as well, but not specifically Rome, and not specifically Jerusalem either. Basically it was the Roman empire incompassing Jerusalem. Now for the second part regarding Jerusalem. The point needed to understand here is that the 'world' to the Jews was their territory/area. Jews worked in Rome as well as Jerusalem and many surrounding areas as you well know, so the world to the Jews, and as portrayed by Jesus, encompasses all these area's. Again, this is why we MUST distinguish WHO Jesus is talking to know the full meaning of His words. You have to realise that at this stage in Mathew 24, Jesus was to come only for the Jews, and so it is the Jewish world in question here...not the whole earth as you suppose.

(Eddie) Ok this is where you misunderstood or got off subject from my question from the verse 14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. I‘m sure it was my fault in the way I was rushing in the writing which may have caused you to misunderstand my true meaning. - What I was getting at was: If Jesus was speaking only in the places He walked, that is by the Jordan River as other local area within Jerusalem then He was talking to only Jews and any strays in the area. This would make it impossible for Him to have delivered a message to all the world (Earth) just walking around in the flesh. Not here, I said 'flesh', not to be confused with what Jesus can do of the spirit.
This witnessing is why He commanded the disciples to go into all their world (as you sated) to preach the gospel. There is another reason for the witness for all believers. Its to do with faith of proclaiming God as God and when judgment happens at His return, rewards will be give to those with pure works of the gospel. Here is where the bible proves that. Just one of many verses.

27. For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

28. Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

You’ll have to read before and after the verses to get the full impact of meaning. As you say: In Context.

Problem is: You were telling me and still telling me Jesus was speaking to a group of some kind. Still you are not telling me Who or What this group is. If you are telling me it’s the Jews only spoken too, as far as the moment of time you are correct. What I was asking is whom is being spoken too in this day and age. The view that Jesus was only talking with Jews and it stopped there, then His words in the bible would not be directed at a single gentile. This could not be what you are saying because you, me and any gentile would be guilty of reading the words of Jesus because, we are not Jews. Your true meaning will likely come up as I read deeper in your letter.

When you are telling me Christ has already returned, I have to ask about the follow verses.

If Jesus has returned as you indicated, where in the heck are the rewards promised in those verses? All I see are those in God being persecuted (as you will likely list in this text somewhere). As stated, I‘m doing my best to read your text with great care. You can correct any misgivings I may be encountering in future mails.).

First off, you first tell me Jesus is talking to the Jews then in the above text you are saying He is talking to us today. That caused a cross conflict in logic. You’ll have to do better explaining that. Where you said: I mean Paul said somewhere in Colossians that the gospel had already been preached in all the world, and this was before the destruction of Jerusalem. You can’t just say Somewhere Paul Said: I need location of the verse(s). Paul could not have said such a thing as there were too many locations and people that have not heard the ‘true’ gospel to even this very today in which you and I live. A.K.A. Carnal thinking of worldism, false teachers in the church and still many are still coming to know Jesus as the Son of God. Anyway, if Jesus has returned where is He today? I hope you’re not going to say he went back to heaven and coming again in a 3^rd coming or worse, tell me he is presently in the flesh, floating around today, hidden in the mist of sociality You wouldn’t tell me that would you mate… That last one is just one step away from the growing UFO cults saying Jesus is coming or has come in a flying saucer from another planet. Yes my friend, the day of deception is only just beginning to brew. Peaking where even the elect could almost be deceived. We are not there yet but as each second passes, its just that much closer to becoming reality.

Anyway, the only temple which would be destroyed would not be the carnal physical one as the whole pederast movement is hung on as being. Just like many got confused when Jesus talked about destroying this temple and raising it back up in 3 days. The carnally minded ones about thought Jesus was talking about the physical building. He was of course talking about the temple of His body. The physical temple as the temple mound is the one whom the whole Muslim cult scene from the 1991 Gulf War to today’s battle is building. You know the war that’s on now?

Remember mate, Jesus came for the Jews, to save them from their sin, and it was only after they denied Him that WE received the gift of salvation. At the time this whole message was given...the Jews were the world to the Jews, and Jesus was a Jew, speaking to Jews.

Ok, you are saying (past tense) ‘was’ speaking to the Jews. I understand perfectly. That is right, He was speaking to them of the time and still the offer goes to any Jew or gentile wishing to strive for truth. Yes, you are repeating this again. I’ll again have to put you back on subject to the question: How by talking to the Jews would the gospel be taken to gentiles? Paul was not a Jew, he was a Roman. He came long after Jesus ascended into heaven. Remember, Jesus came in a vision to Paul as asking: “Why are you persecuting me?” Hence, Paul’s conversion. If you are telling me, and is seems you are, Jesus was only talking to the Jews and no one else. How did Paul come to believe? If you tell me Paul was the mediator or graffer which make the transition between Jews and Genitals, I could understand a bit better.

Before you sent me this mail. I was thinking how you could better help me understand your angle. Do as you have seen me do in my writings. Verse by verse, not missing one. First list the verses to be studied, do a small header introduction and then list the verses again adding short (on subject) remarks of what each means and how one relates to the other. This is CRITICAL to keep God’s word above any opinion from either of us and it totally destroys all man-made doctrines. What I need is a Verse by Verse from Matthew 23:1 to Matthew 25:46 (anyway, every verse from chapters 23 to 25), nothing missed. Now that’s staying with context, not all the hopping around. It will be easier for you to write and for me to read. No more ‘Scramble Ramble’. It works like this:

Yes, it takes time to write, I used to take me a week for a 20 page letter. But most of that was I could not type. Haahaa. Thanks mate.

Since the bible is written to the believers (pagans will not believe it), Jesus was speaking to those with an ear to hear. Right? That in the text of the time would be those by name or area. Since Christ/Father's words are immortal, it is valid for all time. In being valid for all time, it would be just as evident/potent today as any other time. Since God and His word is the same yesterday, today and forever and He is His word, no time lock out would be present.

Mate, what you have written above is the perfect example of using the bible out of context. Please bro, don't follow the multitude who are falsely taught that the bible speaks to them personally. Read it as a novel and you will understand it better. Not perfectly, but at least better than what is taught to the multitude.

Where do you keep on getting this stuff about the bible speaking personal to one person? First you tell me Jesus was talking only to the Jews then you say Paul is speaking to us, now you are saying the bible where Christ words and Paul’s words are not for the believers whom hear/read and know its truth. You are losing me here. When you say read it as a novel, that is (sorry mate) but the carnal way of seeing what takes faith to accept and react on. If its read as a novel, it would be just mixed in as equal as all the man made books in Christian book stores. If you are saying the multitude of religious belief is what I have adopted, you have soon forgotten the ‘stand-alone’, anti-traditional radical, wave maker I’ve been. Mate, I’ve made enemies from coast to coast in the States as well as other places. Today, many have become allies as they have dropped the old dead-wood religious ideas and presently seeing God move in great supernatural ways. I’m really proud of them. Makes me smile to know so many of the real in God are stretching beyond the norms of theory and now operating in the Power of God’s promises.

To what is the bible…; its God’s love letter to all to accept but only a few fully believe. You are reading the bible because you believe its either based on truth or is the full truth without any wavier of any kind. At least its my hope you are reading for that full truth reason.

If you really are saying Jesus was speaking and still speaking to only one nationally or creed of people, the bible would dispel this as Jesus said He came for all to be saved. Read John 3:16 All are called to repent. You are telling me that Jesus came for only some and not others? That would be anti-biblical and shown as pure foolishness. The bible would prove that in a nanosecond. The Pharisee were even included but they would not listen. They were too embossed with religious tradition. Yes, the Pharisees were Jews that would not listen but the disciples and some Jews did believe. Not all rejected Him. Most did but not every person. Where the Pharisee tried to trap Jesus, He said: “Have you not read?” Speaking about the former ones sent with the word of God. Yes, Jesus quoted the old testament prophets when challenged by the opposes.

I should have listed the verse on that one in the last email to you. Ok, that was my fault. I was quoting what Jesus Himself said in His sermons.

We know this was the ‘spiritual ear’ and those with it could understand the wisdom Jesus spoke of. Those without the spiritual ear has a carnal viewpoint and did not believe. Yes, you say He was talking to the Jews and you’ll have to say He is talking to the believers no matter where they are on the Earth today. If only the Jews, then why did they not all convert and surrender to His gospel? Then I’ll have to ask, how is it gentiles as yourself are reading the bible and believing it?

The first part of Revelation was talking to the seven churches...not to me mate.! But does that mean I don't listen to the message? Absolutely not...it shows what we should do and not do also.

I don’t have a clue how you have digressed off on the book of Revelation. If Jesus already came as you keep telling me, that would mean the book of revelation would have to have occurred, why are you saying its not for you? Are you in the 3^rd Earth/2^nd Heaven age? Are you in the transformed body now? As for me, I ‘m still in the flesh as are those I see in the public as I‘m out and about working and running errands. If the 7 trump has happened, where is Jesus now? Why is He not in the temple as the King of King and Lord of Lords? The only one I seeing ruling at this time. The one of the foul of the air, going too and fro seeking whom he may devour. Yes that is the prince of darkness known as Satan.

As the above note, you’ll have to do a verse by verse by verse by verse from Matthew Chapter 23 to Matthew Chapter 25 for me to understand it step by step.

It is Gods words forever as you say mate, BUT, if you recon it speaks directly to the people of today, then you cant help but miss the essence of the story. And with Paul also, was he speaking to us personally? Absolutely not bro, but it is still a good story for us to learn by...by what God does to others back then, He will also do to us today if we mess up. So yes, His words are eternal in that sense...but no, the bible rarely speaks directly to us. As a matter of fact it hardly speaks to us at all in the scheme of things.

Now you are saying Paul was not speaking to us as believers or did I some how misread your text? Ah…… you must have left something out on that one. Paul was/is speaking to who about what? If Paul is not speaking to: Get this now….. (The Body Of Christ - The Bride Of Christ) then what was the point of writing anything at all? You may be trying to tell me the letters he wrote were aimed to a land of people. In the way he addressed the members of a land at the beginning of each letter. That is true but tell me why if it were really dedicated to that group he was addressing by name of the time: “Why was it published as to the masses in the holy bible?” If you think of it. Paul really must not have had a clue in his wildest dreams that his words would be part of the bible. Just in the way you and I write here, we don’t know if these words are being emailed all over the world and even translated in other languages and read by someone in China. So if Paul had such a knowledge, its probable he would have aimed it to all believers in his direct text. In a way, he did, he was writing to all that believed.

The fact remains, his letters were published simply because they were aimed to any and all people facing the same type of need in answer. If you are telling me Paul was to only speak to some and not others, then you are telling me God has goofed by letting it in the word of God, known as the bible.

You keep on telling me Jesus was talking to a special group but fail to ever just say what that group is unless you saying its only the Jews. Now you have said Paul is speaking to some special group? The only special group would be believers. Those with faith, those wishing to repent, those desiring to be about their Father’s business.

Public sermons was where all with an ear to hear, let him hear. It would be foolish for Jesus to say that to disciples selected ahead of time as they had an ear to hear. Even Judas have an ear to hear. If they didn‘t they would have walked away in the first few private or public sermons. Peter did one better when Jesus asked: “Who do you say I am?” Peter heard the voice of God on that one. (Remember the Holy Spirit was not actually sent as yet. Least its not recorded for belivers but only Jesus had the spirit when baptised. This statements needs to be explained better see this link.)

Saying the disciples didn’t have an ear to hear is like saying: “Well Jesus we believe some of what you say but you are full of it on other things.” Its true the disciples were a lame bunch with little to almost no faith but they did not dispel what Christ said. You’ll have to read the sermon, please read such sermons all the way through to get all the details. If this is NOT what you are saying, I humbly and repeatable apologize to you both here in text and in voice chat. This is why I need you to show me things from a verse by verse walk through. It helps me to understand it step by step.

2. And great multitudes were gathered together unto him, so that he went into a ship, and sat; and the whole multitude stood on the shore.

3. And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow;

4. And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up:

5. Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth:

6. And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away.

8. But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold.

10. And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?

11. He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

12. For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.

More Verses (reserved to save space in this doc. Read them all to finally the last verse of the Chapter…

36. Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field.

Mate, you keep on me about staying in context. Please do the same for me. Thanks. J

You are right when you say the bible was written for believers, but in context, it is not all for us believers, although it is all good for learning as Paul said. Most of the bible was written for a certain people of a certain time.

Are you of God or not of God? If you are of God then you would listen to the words Jesus said, what a proven apostle as Paul said and what any one with signs and wonders being proven as sent from God would say. Would you not? As a safely, you would check what man says no matter how well proven by the word of God. In either case it would be much better to listen to one proven than just listening to some of the many unproven blokes on Paltalk (or PrideTalk I often call it from most of the rooms). Why would you listen to someone like the ones you have listened too, over God’s proven servant/teachers like Jesus and Paul?

You say: “The words of Christ are not for all believers?” That sounds like the ‘Pick and Do What I Like’ verses which fit a religious agenda. This pick and choose is EXACTLY how denominations get started. If you mean believers as not pure in God… that is Lukewarm? If you are then such persons are not surrendered believers to begin with. Maybe ‘lukewarm’ is the word you are meaning to use, otherwise, your text is hard to understand.

Relative to what Paul said and unto whom, I’ve already covered that above. How Paul wrote letters to an area at a time but all of the 13 he wrote were published in the bible for all to see and read. No, God does NOT goof. So tell me: “Where in the heck did Paul say some should read and follow and others are not?” Dude, you need to give a set of verses on remarks like that. Either a person is a believer (doer of the word, shows real witness as a believer) or one is going to choose the world’s way of flesh feeding pleasure OR there is a class of person in the process of seeking truth and will come to God once He is seen as who He is in character. There is only one true gospel, its not denominational trash, not speculations of men, not idol chat from the latest buzz preacher out there. Either a person is For God or Against God.

In the final of all this: Either one will reach Heaven or is condemned to perishing in the mist of eternal hell. Its digital. Full On or Full Off. The only possible way you could say there is a split is if you were to say: “Jesus spoke to the Pharisees with correction and the followers with wisdom.” That is the only possible way you could declare a separation factor.

Joshua 24:15. And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.

If you read all the prophecies in the bible, you can find fulfilment for them somewhere else in the bible or history. You are right also by saying Gods words are for all time ... just be careful what is for you and what isn't.

For example, we well know that the OT prophecies of the coming Messiah was directed to the Jews...not us, and we also know that the Messiah was Jesus right? But what do the Jews of today believe it meant? They believe ( because they recon those OT words of God were meant for them) that the Messiah is yet to come, contrary to what the true Jews believed at the time of Jesus on earth. They ran to the hills like Jesus told them to in His prophecy of Mat 24.

Yes, I understand there are sections of Judgment and Supreme Warning to the wicked in the bible. Even the newbies just in the first few bible studies know that without being told. As for the promises and the blessings for the righteous, the bible is for those that will believe and do it. No more, no less. Any that go to church and just hang out but don’t live what Christ or any part where obedience is concerned, those people are not true believers and are guilty of being ‘Lukewarm’ at best. We know what Revelation 3:5 and 3:16 say about that.

The OT prophets did speak of the coming savior and it did come to pass. And yes, there are many Jews that still have the idea of looking for another to still come as Jesus. They’ll get one alright, ‘The son of perdition.‘

As far as following your statements, its hard to get what you are saying when you are saying things like: “Somewhere Paul said” and when you are saying one thing in one paragraph, then something else which seems to totally oppose the first statement. Or when I show you “inline verses” about Jesus talking to the public after you say it was private to only 12 disciples. Again:

This is one of the most important truths in the whole bible, because it exposes the truth that Jesus is here today right now, just like every single believer in this world is saying when they profess Jesus is in their life. How can we ask Jesus into our lives if He isn't here already? Do you mean He sends someone else to us? Is He a liar? I know for sure He is in me because of the miracles and ongoing blessings and revelations, and I am sure you do too bro. I believe Jesus doesn't lie...so when He told the disciples that He would come SOON, He meant soon, not mean 2000 years or more later.

Sorry mate, you are thinking in the carnal mind and I’ll prove it. Hold on tight too your seat and temper…. Give it a chance in pondering and as you meditate, see what happens.:> ‘Soon’ thought of in the carnal mindset would be years. More about this in a moment. First I’ll address what you're saying about Jesus inside. Its not the carnal way of physically inside. To make this crystal clear, look at it like this:

If it were Jesus physically inside, then Jesus would not have said a word and would have put His spirit in all those wanting it or as some have warped it, predestinated or pre-chosen as special. While some may be called in by a special calling of ministry, all have been called to be saved by the intention of Jesus. A.K.A John 3:16. If Jesus did inhabit inside of people as physical, it would totally rob any persons freedom of choice whether to be obedient or not. Those persons would be just robots without sin at anytime. This would show wrong as Jesus and Paul talked about ‘Repentance’. How could one repent unless he or she has chosen to sin and lived by the ways of the flesh? If Jesus was inside as an ‘auto-pilot, this would make it impossible to sin to begin with.

It sounds like you are saying Jesus is physically inside and these persons, persons like all, have fallen short of the Glory (by sinning). This makes it seem that Jesus caused people to sin. See the problem here? From this we know Jesus cannot be inside the flesh body as spirit when the body is prone too sin.

I’ve yet to find any ‘one’ person past or present (beside Jesus of course); which is perfect. Yeah, its easy to find many that think they are but that is just a fiction of living a false fairy-tale. Jesus over-taking any person as physical is not what happened.

HERE IS THE SECRET: The words, yes, words (all combined in one is known as word ‘singular’); of what Jesus the Christ ‘spoke’, recorded in the 4 gospels we know of as Matthew, Mark, Luke and John as well as the book of Revelation, IS THE CHRST in the person. Total adoption of these words (beyond theory but in principal operation) is one(s) that has or should be confirmed to performing in the character of Jesus. This would make that person or persons to be Christ-Like. Now, does that make sense to you?

In addition, its not only ‘What’ Jesus spoke but HOW Jesus spoke? You talk about WHO Jesus speaks too but you left out ‘How’. When Jesus speaks He speaks in the Heavenly, in the Eternal? Proof? Parables is what He used. Speaking things not comprehensive to the flesh mind. One example is how He spoke about heaven. It is too great for the carnal or even the most spiritual mind to understand without being there.

Now to relate this: When He says soon it ‘zipped‘ right over the understanding of those trying to figure it out in a Earthly way. As for the time factor you brought up, it could be 100,000 years just a starting number. That time would be less than a vapor of time when compared to eternity. Look at it like this: How many years was it before Christ came as the Son of Man? 20 years? 500 years? 900 years? 4000? How many years knows as BC (Before Christ) have passed? It was a long many, many, many, many generations before Jesus came in the flesh to the world, so how is it to be measured in mere Earth years? It can‘t. So you see, the second you stop thinking in the carnal. You’ll see 100,000, 250,000 years or even a Million years would be very, very soon. Again, what would this time mean when compared to eternity?

If Jesus wanted to come back thousands of years later, He would have said...listen my good blokes, I go now, but I will be back in a long long long time. All you guys will be long dead, and mankind will be flying to the moon and doing organ transplants by then.

Haahaa - See you are thinking in the carnal of earth years and age. Think in the eternal and see how it sounds.

All the above was fulfilled during the tribulation of the Jews between AD64 and AD70 when Jerusalem was finally levelled. Like you mate, I could not believe all the above had already happened, that was until I read the writings of Flavius Josephus who is the oldest witness to the destruction of Jerusalem. He was born about the time Jesus died and was a disciple of one of the other disciples...I cant remember which one at the minute, but he died at the turn of the first century, so apart from the writings in the bible, his are the next oldest and can be trusted as he was later attached to one of Jesus' followers. This guy talks about things happening like never before...earthquakes, pestilence and everything that is mentioned in the verses above. Remember, the disciples were killed because of Jesus' name sake also, just like He said they would. If you want I can get the historical account of it and send it to you. Sooner of later you will have to read it.

From verse 7: Are not nations rising up against nation in this time of 2006 and have been for many past generations? Do we still not have pestilences, earthquakes, famines as well as floods, more powerful storms growing with greater intensity these days than in any other time of the past?

Mate, we have had nation rising against nation ever since Adam and Eve, but the point is, according to the history books, during AD65-70 there were also many wars and rumours of wars, more than now even. At the moment, it seems to be more peaceful ( except for them darn Muslims) than ever before in history. Iraq is not a war against a nation...it is war against terror. Different thing totally. Its more religion against religion now. Anyway, all through history this has been going on, but the historical accounts of AD70 were pretty bad. I don't see any mention of storms in the endtime prophecy (its possible I missed it tho), but as far as the pestilence and earthquakes etc, there was plenty of that during the destruction of Jerusalem. Those unbelieving Jews suffered so much with hunger that some even ate their own children.

Did the time of 70AD have the great spy network known today as Echelon? Did 70AD have the dirty movies and porn sites as today? Are you going to tell me Jesus being pure is letting this go on without the first effort of rising up and speaking against it? Did 70AD have satellites tracking people as is in progress of becoming evident today? The answer is no. What you are saying is: “There was evil back then.” Well yeah, and the news flash is, its just as strong if not stronger today.
Why are you giving me past record of what has happened when that was the first thing I said. Read it again. I said Past Generations.

Are not nations rising up against nation in this time of 2006 and have been for many past generations?

I was asking how these things come to be more in intensity, as per the Birth Pains to the return of Christ, happening TODAY. You didn’t touch it. Why? Have you never studied the events at the return of Christ? Like the Judgment?

From verse 8: If these are the Beginnings when spoken to happen, why are they multiplied today if not still in tribulation? If we are still in tribulation then what did Jesus promise at His return, continued tribulation?

How do you know they are worse today than back then? Do you see 50,000 armed men running around USA or Australia killing all in their path? Do you see dead babies everywhere? Do you see hungry people eating their children? Quite the contrary mate, the worst thing that can happen to us is to end up on the dole...but we never will go hungry. You see mate, many others make this same mistake. If they knew history, then they would know that we live in the best times ever. We are not still in tribulation. Compared to the destruction of Jerusalem...this is heaven. Even the poorest people in the west don't go hungry.

I never said anything about evil being greater back then, that is your assumption. As for the 50,000 armed men running about… Is it not possible you forgot terrorist and nations with armed forces ready to embark on a war world wide? That would beat the 70AD gig thousands of times over. It would not be just one nation but many nations. Also, just seeing the time now as it stands is not the full frame of time in how things will turn out. Meaning, all that is dark can and showing to get darker with every day progressing.

To answer you the best I am able to understand what you are saying and/or asking: What is seen is evil in triumph. Rising in all planes of the present day Earth. What you are saying is: Jesus returned and allows evil run ramped? That makes Him sound so weak and worthless. Mate, you have not done any study on what happens when Christ returns. Here is just ONE example. Take a good read of: Zechariah 14 The Whole Chapter.

1. Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2. For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3. Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4. And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5. And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

6. And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:

7. But it shall be one day which shall be known to the Lord, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

8. And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.

9. And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.

So you see the Lord will ‘Battle’. That has not happened yet. Look at the last verse for one example. And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one. That is not today. Jesus is the Prince of Peace but before there can be peace, there has to be a established form of peace. Then Jesus is the Lord or Prince over that Peace, but from what your saying, He is not, or so it seems you are saying He is not. There are so many trying to root out the Name of God/Jesus and the bible, if Christ has returned the bible is a worthless lie and Jesus is not defending the innocent as so promised in the bible.

From verse 9 and 10: With today’s ever-rising political system with an agenda for condemning the ones in Christ (A.K.A United Nations and politics world wide), it rising to this point of ones being killed for their faith. Only the muslins get away with it scot-free. Another example if a homosexual is said to be wicked by God’s view then the person saying it is considered trouble. If Christ has returned, why is all this still going on?

Do you really believe that in this day and age that Christians could ever be killed by governments for doing nothing wrong? Christianity rules the world mate. Think about it. I can assure you for what it's worth mate, Countries like America, Australia, England, and half of Europe, that are Christian base, will never be killing Christians unless of course they go bonkers and kill others. There is only one way that can happen, and that is if Muslims rule the world. Even with nuclear weapons, Muslims will never get to do that mate. Many mainly Muslim populated countries like Pakistan, Turkey, and some African nations are on the side of the west because they know which side their bread is buttered. There is only one country that might be of any danger, and that is Iran, but even in Iran, the populous is protesting against the harsh treatment they get from their Government which is virtually run by that Muslim wacker Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, the religious leader of Iran. Christians have never ever in history been so protected, as what they are today. In the first century they were literally hunted like wild dogs by the Jews and Romans...today they run the world.

First statement: I never said the government would kill any Christian directly, I was saying the World System would simply Allow it to happen. As we see today, Christians being struck down for the Godly stance all the while Muslim extremist striking out in terror is seen as ok by those crying out: “No War, no war, no war. Too bad, war came without an invitation from the first strike in 2001. I was talking in the last mail about where evil, crooked judges are in the normal and supreme court push more and more with letting evil triumph. Where your parliament is trying to overtake John Howard. Where the world system lets punks wanting to take God’s word and/or prayer out of the school system (in the United States anyway), do it without recourse.

You are telling me: When Jesus was to come back, this wasn't to mean evil will stop, it simply meant there would be a place for all Christians who believed in the way of Christ, and a place for all those that didn't. Where Jesus talks of the new Jerusalem where there will be no darkness, this is simply the place we are in right now.

Mate, you are not reading parts of the bible in areas like posted above. Zechariah 14 is just one example. If you have read them, try to read them and not see the bible as some lame novel. Read it as it was meant: God’s Holy, Pure, Divine, Relevant, Authoritative Word.

The end of the Age we are in and the end of time you are confusing. Try to see if spiting the two makes more sense. Even if you don’t, please remember what happens when Jesus Returns. The wicked are dealt with:

The gnashing their teeth is the ones cast out of the presents of God, that is judgment of the battle on the wicked to finally where they are cast in to the pit known as hell. Again this has not happened.

Matthew 13:30. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn. - Read the whole of 13 and 14^th chapters for full info.

Where you say, Jesus said “I would like to gather you as a hen gathers her chicks”, you are crossing metaphors. This is one of the times Jesus really was talking to a select group. The Pharisee group; which got in the way of the flock and Jesus divine word. Mate, please read your bible in context as you tell me to do.

Luke 13:13 31. The same day there came certain of the Pharisees, saying unto him, Get thee out, and depart hence: for Herod will kill thee.

32. And he said unto them, Go ye, and tell that fox, Behold, I cast out devils, and I do cures to day and to morrow, and the third day I shall be perfected.

33. Nevertheless I must walk to day, and to morrow, and the day following: for it cannot be that a prophet perish out of Jerusalem.

34. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!

35. Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

Just one example. This mail is getting long, I’ll reserve the greater details when this page becomes a website.

From verse 11: Are there still false prophets running amuck today? If Jesus the Christ has returned back in 70AD, is He really allowing his name and His people to be slave to the wicked agenda of Satan?

Again mate, solong as there is evil, there will be deceivers, but what Jesus is speaking of here is the likes of Simon Magus and his camp who completely twisted the ways of Christ into another gospel that was not of God. There were others of course, but Magus and his dogs would have to be the main ones. Sure there are allot of false teachers today in the protestant circle, but when they start teaching things like idol worship and Mother of God worship, THEN we should be worried. So long as they stick to the basic principle of overcoming sin and the world...then they cant really do much damage.

From verse 12: If Christ has returned, why are we still seeing the love growing cold?

From verse 13: Enduring to the end - what is the end? End of what? Is the end when Christ returns?

Jesus is telling His disciples that if they endure to the end all the oppression and torture etc from the Jews and Romans, and remain faithful, they will be saved. So the end is when Jerusalem is destroyed and Jesus comes back, so yes, you got it right mate, the end is when Jesus returned. The end is the end of the old covenant and could only be complete when Jesus returned. That's the correct meaning, but this does not mean we can't use this verse (and others where they suit) as good teaching for all Christians obviously.

In short, if Christ has returned and as per just one example verses like in: Matthew Chapter 13, where the wheat and the chaff are separated, where Christ takes out the evil at his return, I still try to see why we are seeing the evil triumph if Christ has already returned to fix all this.

I don't see this relevant to the return of Jesus, but it is a very good question. I know the answer mate, but I can't tell you right now. When I finally understood this parable, I soul leapt for joy mate. This parable is misunderstood by most according to what God gave me, but it is something that each lover of God must find for themselves I believe. Sorry, but I don't see in the bible where it says Jesus or God will fix all this evil when Jesus returns. See "New Jerusalem" where it says evil still exists after Jesus returns.

Simply my friend, its hard to know evil would stop when Christ returns if you have not studied the ‘battle’ plan of what Christ does when He does return. He is going put a dead stop to all false witnessing and the evil ones which use his name in vain. Please consider looking into this. It would be more than this mail would be room for here and now. The little letter is not so little anymore. Wow, it will be something like 38 pages now. Wow!

Of course John, Paul the Apostle and others seen it in their lifetime. No man knows the time of Christ return. The beauty of Paul, John and any other not setting dates of Christ return shows first, they are not defying the word of what Jesus said about the coming of the age (His return age that is) and second it makes God’s word timeless for all generations that has came and will come. The last hour as you say is again what I have explained as your view if looking at this in the carnal mindset. Soon would not mean mere years as the flesh sees but in the time frame as the Father sees.

No man know the time of His return. The bible declares this without any speculation from anyone trying to decode it from any self biased, denominational and man-made doctrinal view..

Here are a few from the pederast favorite book to lie about: Matthew 24. Where the chapter itself proves no man knows of the time. Funny how this book is the one chosen as where man has declared he knows when Christ came back. That is not too smart.

1. And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.

2. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

3. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Matthew 24:36. But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

You know I’m not trying to deceive you as this was proven time and time again when I gave you space to work out things for yourself. I just ask why you would want to let those on Paltalk influence you in ways unbecoming of Christ character?

When you consider that at the time Jesus said this, creation was only 4000 years old, and to expect 2000+ years to mean "soon" in the scheme of things, is utterly ridiculous. And to say that Jesus is in us when we don't believe He is even here, is a bit hypocritical to say the least. A few hundred years of brain washing has manufactured a modern day teaching method that goes totally against the grain of the way of Jesus who is the Master teacher, and to go with this false teaching like a blind sheep is only ............ to the lukewarmness of modern Christianity.

Just the point, when Jesus truly does return, there is not more Luke warmness. As there would be no doubt He is real and is in full power over the Earth. Again, you’ll have to read the sections of this subject and not speculate on evil as just going on as Christ is powerless to stop it. Lets keep Jesus strong and in His true character mate. There are enough in the world trying to dispel His power and glory.

Ok, all done. I put allot into this mate, so I hope this helps give more understanding. I would like (with your permission ) to add it to my web site... it would help others with same questions.

Hey, I was thinking about the same. Not so much as the questions part but this doc got so BIG, it may have to put on the site just for you to read it. I’ve had troubles in the past about mails being so big, the mail client or server cuts it off (truncates) text without warning. I’ll either have sent you this as a Zipped text file or put on the web for you to see. You’ll know when you see it.

I don't profess to be 100% correct on all things as I would be surprised if anyone could guarantee that, but the theme, i.e the 2nd Advent, I am sure of. Not only am I sure, but this truth is more like in keeping with the character of the God I know. He has always been a just God, and raptures and dreams of Jesus ruling in the flesh, is contrary to His nature.

That was a big doc. That was a lot of fun to write on. If anything, it gave me more typing practice. Mate the other day, I was working with some wood and got a monster splinter in my thumb. It hurts like mad after I took it out and my typing is slower than normal. I hope my typing is readable without too many typos. Sorry for the book result. When I start typing it takes a den of lions to even get my attention to stop. Even then, I just toss a steak to them and keep on typing. Haahaa

Just the closing out: You speak about the lukewarm ones. Do you really think Jesus would come back and let evil and the lukewarm have power over His people? Would Jesus let the 10 commandments be struck down and let real Christians be called a hate group if the speak against a homosexual? Where is the judgment against the wicked? Where are the rewards to the righteous?

Mike, you are a very special friend I respect to the utmost. This you have seen in all the past dealings. Never have I impress any idea of my own on to you. The above is just taking what you have said and putting verses of What God/Bible says. When I do ask a question I can see every time a question about the present time is addressed you always and in vain revert back to some past history report having no source of verses whatsoever. If I were a newbie, you could get those notions to take root. I’m not a newbie, it won’t work. I’m not as you may think, that is, not been one to sit in a church teaching the norms of traditions. If you think so, you have totally forgotten the letters I’ve sent out repelling the norms of religion. Also you have forgotten the host of enemies I have made. Many of those where were enemies have studied and have awoken from such old traditional ideas.

As to your ideas, Please mate, for the sake of my best understanding. I’ll have to ask you to do what I’ve shown above. A verse by verse by verse by verse by verse step through. If you have reached to this last section of the text and not ready to come kick my donkey on things said you may not have liked, then you have proven as being a real friend that no lack of disagreement can break. This is my hope. We continue to share as what we learn and live in God of the Most High.

( Eddie had originally entered 136 verses here that were Mathew chapters 23 to 25 of which I have deleted to save 9 1/2 pages of space. Please read if you wish from your own bibles)

Cover ALL of these versed one by one without skipping any. No junk from what man has said, no personal speculations and no ‘scripture hop scotching’ unless pointing to reference verses.

Now first let me remind you of why we are debating the return of Jesus Christ. Firstly, it is because you said in chat about 3 months ago now, that I don't share my beliefs with you, so now I have...and secondly it is because of what you said in an earlier email as follows:

I ask these question in a valid form. Please help me to understand how these things and be in this time frame we live in if Christ has returned in 70AD.

I did not really want to get into a debate about it initially, but only to enlighten you on what I knew and believed. Now it has turned into a bit of suggestive name calling and accusations of carnality. If it goes on too much further, it could lead to anger by either one of us or both, and that could have a devastating consequence of which I am sure both of us would not really want.

As my answers to your questions were considered carnal, I saw no real sense in replying anymore as it would be in vain, and for about 6 weeks had decided indeed not to, but then I saw it as a challenge and even an educational experience, so I have given it ago. If some of the following offends you in any way, please consider the full gist question I am answering first, before you make a call.

It looks huge, but all your text from b4, and previous emails that I have included as well, takes up at least half, so really its not that big.

I have also included all the emails prior to this one at the end so you can always refer to them if you get confused by my reply to your text. Also I have separated each email by a line (as below) to find them easier. Your text in green and mine black.

...Replay One: As we talked about in chat…. You asked which was the greatest prophet. I told you it is Carnal to think like that: That any ‘true’ in the Most High God would pronounced what God has given them to say. Yes, there were Major and Minor prophets but even that is just as they are seen by people. God does not does not think in such a foolish ways. He seeks the heart and obedience. You agreed 100% saying… “Never mind, you’re right..”

Now, if you said Jesus was the greatest servant, greatest witness and greatest teacher, and the one perfect in faith without limitation, then yeah, you would be 100% right.

Firstly mate, you were jumping ahead of me when you started talking about major and minor prophets etc. All I was trying to do was make it clear that what Jesus says in any shape or form, is above all that man says. All previous prophets were just good men, but Jesus is above men, so by showing that because Jesus was a prophet ( besides many other things), and our creator as well...then surely this makes Him above all other prophets and gives more credence to what He says above all other men as well. When I asked that question of you, I expected you to agree Jesus was the greatest prophet, but you went on talking about other things not to the point of my question. Now when I said "never mind, you are right", I said this because you were having difficulty understanding my point, and it looked like it would take a lot of explaining to get my point across to you...so I said this to bring to an end the subject. I sensed at the time you were getting irate, so I thought it best to quit. I did not want to offend you. So in short all I was trying to get you to agree/understand to...is that anything Jesus said, whether in teaching or prophecy, His words are greater than any other man. As well as being a teacher, He was also a prophet. He passed on info from the Father...that makes Him a prophet no matter what way you want to look at it. And the fact that He prophesised the end of the Old Covenant age, and brought in the New Covenant THROUGH HIMSELF, makes Him the greatest of all. This was the greatest event in bible history and never will there be greater. Not only did He prophesise, but He was PART of the prophecy as well. Was any other prophet in all the bible a part of their own prophecy? Indeed no, only Jesus has this acclaim. As far as God regarding one above the other....just a sample from the bible.

I don’t get offended to anything you say. I try to be adult about behaving as above the flesh would like. Promise to do the same with my comments?

The only thing you did do one time which was shocking was when you invited me in the room with the pederast 70AD guy’s room and boldly told me: “This is what I believe and if you don’t like it, you can find yourself another friend!” Mate, that was a bit ‘cold-blooded‘. Do you remember doing that? You did. I thought about it all night at work. I was very disturbing how just a few weeks with another, the 3^rd paltalk doctrine pusher you get involved with has got you to say something so rude. First it was Vic, then Matthew Lancaster and now this new one. Visiting rooms are ok but not to adopt anyone’s views. Again before you get offended, please read this all the way through with the same care as I done in reading your text.

Eddie my friend, whether I said it exactly like that I am not sure, but that still stands. If you don't like it... then move on mate. If that offends you, then you are not of the calibre I look to for friendship. It was not just said to you...it was said to all my friends who I invited to that room that day. Maggilla, Watchman, Crested wave and some others . Maybe it was a bit rough, but that’s the way I am, straight down the line, and it was said to let all know where I stand now. As it turned out, they all left me because of what I now believe, not because it seemed rude to them, and I am in great appreciation to God that they did. There is one thing I detest...and that is hypocrites. If people are going to love you just because you agree with them, then shove it as far as I am concerned. Its all about how a person would treat me, and love God, that I decide whether I like them or not. They all showed their true colour...and I am grateful. Mate, if you don’t know me by now, you never will. Whereas you might shower me with chocolate to attempt to gain my acceptance and confidence, I will on the other hand tell you exactly as I see it. You will never die wondering what I am really thinking...I keep no secrets. What you see is what you get! By saying what I did, I was frank and upfront showing (boldly as you say) to everyone, that God's truth is more important to me than friendship. The fact you don't believe it is the truth, does not mean it is not the truth. If you take this personally, then you totally misunderstand my point of declaration. I was merely letting you all know that my belief that Jesus is already come back, so you will know what to expect will be part of all future discussions. The fact that you are of the multitude, as I once was also, that believe it is " a 3rd Paltalk doctrine" as you call it, will only make our future discussions about our Lord difficult, so it needed to be said. If you don't like the WAY I said it, then that is another issue mate. In that case, maybe you should make it known. This is not a small thing. This new believe completely changes the direction of the spirit. It brings one ever so close to God, knowing His Spirit in Jesus is already here now at work in me.

I totally understand what you are saying here...just cant figure why is all. It has absolutely nothing to do with replying to the paragraph that I said. All that paragraph was talking about context...nothing else. I thank you that you did leave me alone and give me space, just like Mathew and Gospel Gorilla did. It is what I would expect though from anyone.

I decided to get involved with them, and I decided when to get un-involved, it was actually a great learning curb for me and if I had to, I would go through it all again. You don't see why I spent time with these guys...I did it to learn. By doing this, I am acknowledging that I don't know it all. One must listen if one wants to learn. I still regard Mathew much higher than most...at least he had a go. I don't blame him in the slightest for the Ronice episode. they are both responsible adults who can look after themselves. They BOTH were at fault. Neither one more than the other. It sounds to me that you are saying that I needed to be saved from them. If it is, then you mad a wrong judgment mate...I was never in danger.

Just a sub note from one of your last emails: You said you’re planning to write a book on the Rapture. Not much a point these days to many. A grand number are not into it anymore. Only the ones trying to sell books or the readers scared of facing reality and not know God’s protection in the time of trouble will read such dribble as what the rapture authors write. Many people are waking up beyond the ‘get out of here’ but many are learning their identity in God and knows He will not only protect them but make the ones full in faith, pillars for witnessing by words and more important, by ‘living’ the stability of what God promised.

Seriously mate...you must be from another planet. That’s all I can say about that. There is only one traditional Protestant Christian in 10,000 that DON'T believe in a rapture STILL. As a matter of fact, besides myself, I don’t know of any other in Australia at least. I don’t know where you get "grand number" from. 1000 people is many yes…but in the world, that is only a grain of sand. Man, I cant believe you are against a book that might help others get away from traditional Rapture beliefs. Even if only half of Christianity believed in that trash…it would still be worth it.! The books that people want to make money out of are PRO rapture...mine is going to be ANTI rapture. The more the merrier I say.

History is critical to prophecy, and is only learned by study and reading. If you choose not to read, and go on your gut feeling for your decisions by what you hear others say, then I understand why you are against it. The bible is a good history book in itself, as well as some of Gods teaching, but not all. History shows where the Rapture came from and why it came. When the world cant make up its mind of the true meaning of stories in the bible... history then can play a part in proving one way or another. History shows that for over 1700 years nobody had a clue about a rapture. History is no mess my friend. History is a guide to perfection. Its a shame more people did not learn from history. Although it may not be the total answer, history surely adds weight to the answer. If you feel it feeds doubt to the weak seeking truth by revealing historical truth, then I would have to say that feeling would not be the normal view of most. I would welcome any debate on this. As far as you suggesting I don't use bible verses goes, sheesh mate, you cant be reading my work...it's jammed full of them. I do have to change some though, as when I started this a year ago, I had not yet discovered the truth about the 2nd Advent. When/if I do write this book, it will include all evidence against the rapture, both biblically and historically, as well as anything else God gives me to add. Of course this will probably be construed as my own opinions by most if not all, but what it WONT be, is a superficial account of the facts, ... I can assure you this.

Just like I’ve done with Ruining the Rapture and Rupturing the Rapture letters. Did you notice, how there was not 20 miles of text on the history the readers didn’t need? It was what the bible said.

Yes, I agree that bible verses are the best evidence, but more is needed to confirm sometimes, and that is where history comes into play. It is only your opinion that the readers don't need it. Any fool can read the bible and come up with a whole bunch of different meanings, (as you well know)but if you have history to back up a meaning, then you can feel pretty safe that the bible is portraying the correct meaning to you. You say God gives you discernment of the true meaning, but so do I. So who is right and who is wrong? We both cant be right can we? A perfect example is the New Testament ... Imagine how the bible would look if the stories of what happened (history lol) wasn't recorded. We would be stuck with the Torah...oh noooooooo!

You see, its not the debate text which brings truth and freedom to any but overstepping all that and presenting the truth by verses.You see, that is the problem with books written in past years and even today. What man has said… what man has done, what man has said… what man has done. All dribble.

No mate...not all! What man has done with history, has complemented the bible as truth. It proves the bible prophecy. Be careful you don't throw the baby out with the bath water. You have to remember what God told Israel regarding prophecy

If there is no history...then there is no proof for others in the future. If the gospels weren't recorded in history, then you would not have known Jesus had come the first time even.

The bible is NOT the only word of God...we have other gospels, we have the Holy Spirit, and we have HISTORY, to show us the ways of God. If you are one of them bible only people, you will be left behind mate. The bible has many many mistakes and contradictions and false translations. How do I know this? Because I have studied it comprehensively enough to find them. Here is a little sample:

Rev 22:16 "_I_, Jesus, sent My angel to testify to you* [or, tell you* about] these [things] concerning the assemblies. _I_ am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright, Morning Star!" (ALT)

Rev 22:16 "I, Jesus, have sent my angel to announce these things to you in the churches. I am descended from the family of David; I am the bright morning star." (GNB)

Isa 14:12 "How you have fallen from heaven, O star of the morning, son of the dawn! You have been cut down to the earth, You who have weakened the nations! (NASB)

Isa 14:12 King of Babylon, bright morning star, you have fallen from heaven! In the past you conquered nations, but now you have been thrown to the ground. (GNB)

Now can you please tell me which is the real morning star...Jesus or Satan? Isaiah says Satan and revelations says Jesus

I know this might seem frivolous to you, but what it does prove to all is...the bible cannot be ALL God inspired, because God does not make mistakes. If you had studied the making of the KJV bible you would understand. If you want more of the above, just let me know.

Any fool can write a book. Its only the ones called by God into true ministry for God that prevail as evident with signs and wonders. So, from that. If you want to write a publication or even a book which is effective, pay attention to what the bible says and so can your readers know more about God and His supreme character. If you do have to write history on history, do it on the website so a link can be added to give choice to the reader if he or she wishes to research the historic angle of the subject.

Blimey teddy, now you have me worried mate. You make out ALL my writing is about history. Sure I add some here and there, but I challenge you to show me where I would over do it. I use much scripture also, I just don’t use scripture only. Are you afraid of history Eddie? History is what PROVES prophecy. History is the greatest teacher as I have said. Find even one person besides yourself that does not agree we should learn by history. What's your angle here? I thank you for your advice mate, but I recon you are wrong this time, and I am mystified that you might think I would write about such an important subject without the bible. Show me anywhere where I write history on history. Frankly mate, and I hope you are man enough to take it, that’s all dribble. And thanks for putting me in the "fool" category. Beauty mate.

Pro 26:12 Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? there is more hope of a fool than of him.

Pro 29:20 Seest thou a man that is hasty in his words? there is more hope of a fool than of him.

Eddie : From verse 7: Are not nations rising up against nation in this time of 2006 and have been for many past generations? Do we still not have pestilences, earthquakes, famines as well as floods, more powerful storms growing with greater intensity these days than in any other time of the past?

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